Interesting Debate on Goalies

barry33 · Guru

Interesting Debate on Goalies

Nil d · Guru

barry33 wrote:

Today on the Team 990, Tony Marinaro posed a question to the viewers to get feedback. He asked who between these 3 goalies, was the most dominant goalie short term (like one season, not talking career or long term). Hasek, Roy, or Brodeur. I have to side with alot of the callers and say Hasek. When he was at his peak, there was none better. Roy even when he was at his best, had a habit of allowing one bad goal a game. When Hasek was in his prime (Buffalo) there was no one better period. He was simply unbeatable. In '98- '99 when with the sabres he had a 1.87 GAA average and .937% save percentage on a team that was not that great and he went to the finals vs Dallas. Brodeur and Roy have had great years but lets face it, Brodeur has had the benefit of very sound defensive teams in Jersey. Long term I say Roy has had the best career. Short term for my money, Hasek.

I agree wholeheartedly, Barry.

I personally think Roy is a tad over-rated. He was great yes, but not in the all-time top 5 in my humblest of opinions.

Habtastic · Guru

Get behind me, Nil-d! Roy not in the top 5?! For shame... :)

Habtastic

Figaro · Guru

I'd have to go with Hasek. Roy was the best of his time and, over a long career, had time to put up great numbers with championship teams.

I'm curious, Nil, who are your top 5? Plante, Vezina, Hainsworth, Dryden and Hasek?

beakermania · Senior Member

Here is my rule on goalies.

1 Game... Game 7 of the Stanley Cup Finals, who do you want in net.

If my lineup is about equal or better than the other team i want Patrick Roy, he did not lose many big games, through his career it is shown he was the best money goalie ever.

If my lineup is outclassed by the other team and I need a goalie who will pull off a miracle to give me a chance to win then i want Hasek, as he has shown that he has the ability to do that in the past.

Ando · Guru

And-o can barely believe his eyes! Clearly this heat-wave is getting to some of you!!!

Patrick Roy is/was without a doubt…beyond reproach and/or comparison…THE best money goal keeper of all-time/any-time PERIOD

And-o can’t recall Patrick having 2 “bad games” in a row. Plus, Patrick Roy’s swagger and confidence between the pipes elevated his teammates so much! The guy just seemed to thrive in the spotlight.

The guy was capable (and quite willing) to guarantee his mates that no other goals would be scored against…and he had the jam to back-it-up…LITERALLY!!!

How good was Patrick??? Man, does And-o wish he had a time-machine…because you could take BOTH Marty and Dom (along with an undeniably better defense)…And-o will take Patty and show you just how good he REALLY is/was!!!

Sheesh…talk about critics!!! We Hab fans are REALLY, REALLY difficult to please!

Cripes…just think…if Pat Roy had been a Leaf, they would name landmarks after the guy!!!

…seek shade fellas!!!

Diehardhabsfan · Veteran Member

Ando wrote:

And-o can barely believe his eyes! Clearly this heat-wave is getting to some of you!!!

Patrick Roy is/was without a doubt…beyond reproach and/or comparison…THE best money goal keeper of all-time/any-time PERIOD

And-o can’t recall Patrick having 2 “bad games” in a row. Plus, Patrick Roy’s swagger and confidence between the pipes elevated his teammates so much! The guy just seemed to thrive in the spotlight.

The guy was capable (and quite willing) to guarantee his mates that no other goals would be scored against…and he had the jam to back-it-up…LITERALLY!!!

How good was Patrick??? Man, does And-o wish he had a time-machine…because you could take BOTH Marty and Dom (along with an undeniably better defense)…And-o will take Patty and show you just how good he REALLY is/was!!!

Sheesh…talk about critics!!! We Hab fans are REALLY, REALLY difficult to please!

Cripes…just think…if Pat Roy had been a Leaf, they would name landmarks after the guy!!!

…seek shade fellas!!!

I'm with you 100% and-o

Nil d · Guru

Figaro wrote:

I'd have to go with Hasek. Roy was the best of his time and, over a long career, had time to put up great numbers with championship teams.

I'm curious, Nil, who are your top 5? Plante, Vezina, Hainsworth, Dryden and Hasek?

Well, I haven't really got an official Top 5, but some of you are blinded by recent years and were not around to see some of the great ones. I would rank ahead of Roy these ones:

Jacques Plante

Terry Sawchuk

Glenn Hall

Ken Dryden

Tony Esposito

As good as, or worthy to be mentioned in the same breath:

Martin Brodeur

Dominik Hasek

Don't know much about these guys, but most 80-year-olds would say they were better:

Georges Vezina

George Hainsworth

Turk Broda

Bill Durnan

rwp2le · Guru

I personally didn't see some of the greats like Dryden, Sawchuck and Venzina, but IMHO Patrick Roy is the greatest goaltender I have ever seen. Roy's consitancy and winning attitude makes him much than Hasek. On a side note, I used to love it when the Refs weren't making the calls Saint Patrick thought he should, he would hold the puck in his glove until the linesman got close, then he would throw the puck in the corner.

Nil d · Guru

rwp2le wrote:

I personally didn't see some of the greats like Dryden, Sawchuck and Venzina, but IMHO Patrick Roy is the greatest goaltender I have ever seen. Roy's consitancy and winning attitude makes him much than Hasek. On a side note, I used to love it when the Refs weren't making the calls Saint Patrick thought he should, he would hold the puck in his glove until the linesman got close, then he would throw the puck in the corner.

So the NHL has been around for 100 years and you have witnessed 15 of them and proclaim Roy the greatest? That was my point to And-o. Roy may have been the greatest in the 90's, but there are 9 more decades to look at.

barry33 · Guru

Nil d wrote:

rwp2le wrote:

I personally didn't see some of the greats like Dryden, Sawchuck and Venzina, but IMHO Patrick Roy is the greatest goaltender I have ever seen. Roy's consitancy and winning attitude makes him much than Hasek. On a side note, I used to love it when the Refs weren't making the calls Saint Patrick thought he should, he would hold the puck in his glove until the linesman got close, then he would throw the puck in the corner.

So the NHL has been around for 100 years and you have witnessed 15 of them and proclaim Roy the greatest? That was my point to And-o. Roy may have been the greatest in the 90's, but there are 9 more decades to look at.

And-O misses the point..again..I did not say who had the best career. Or who was best over a period of time. I said who was the best short term..like one season. And there was a time that Hasek was simply unbeatable..period.

Diehardhabsfan · Veteran Member

The best goalie of all time was Andre Racicot ( Red light Racicot)...............................Hahahaha

Now in all seriousness I do agree with Barry if you are talking short term.

norskipaul · Senior Member

The only one's on the "old-timer" list I had the pleasure to see were Dryden and Esposito, and of those two, no contest. I never saw Roy as a Hab, can't say anything about him. When it comes to Hasek I saw him playing for Czechoslovakia way back when, and he could work miracles even then. I've never really followed him through an entire season so, well, I'll just take Barry's word for it...Wait a sec, I remember seeing Glenn Hall as well...He played for the Blues ca. 1970...? Man, i must be getting old...

AB Habman · Guru

I can tell you who the classiest in this decade is......Broduer.

plouf · Guru

I agree with Barry here. Over the course of one season, nobody has had seasons like Hasek had for Buffalo. He made that team competitive. He was a money goalie too. But he just didn't have the luck to play for the right teams most of his career.

Not taking anything away from Roy either. Also a money goalie, and surely the best goalie of the 1990s, but if you just want one season of a guy at his peak, Hasek had the highest peak. He was unbeatable for a few years there.

Habtastic · Guru

In one season, yes Hasek. But Roy was never a stats goalie, he just did what he had to do to get the win. He made the stops that needed to be made to turn his team's fortunes around and he was dominant in the play-offs.

He's also the reason I became a Habs/Hockey fan.

Habtastic

Karim · Newbie

I would have to also include Vladislav Tretiak as one of the great goalies .

keVin · Member

short term goalie success = conn smythe trophy

'nuff said

Nil d · Guru

Karim wrote:

I would have to also include Vladislav Tretiak as one of the great goalies .

Good point. I agree wholeheartedly. I was only thinking of NHL goalies, but he was a classic, and if I'm not mistaken is in the Hockey Hall of Fame, perhaps the only non-NHL goalie in there.

Johab · Guru

Personally, i think it is impossible to compare goalies of present day to goalies of the past. Goalies now are much more athletic and technically sound. As are the shooters. If you were say to swap Roy into Drydens time and dryden now, Roy would be unbeatable and dryden would be done like fried chicken. THEN AGAIN. Roy owes his success to guys like dryden who developed the game, and gave roy the chance to improve on it. No one starts off perfect. There evenually will be a better goalie that Roy, Brodeur, Hasek ( Luongo on a good team would be DANGEROUS! ) Its the same as comparing teams now against teams of the 60's. Its tough to say if Wayne Gretzky would have the same success he did now that he did back in the 80's/90's will how much bigger and faster the game is ( I say he could )

If i had to pick best money goalie...no one but Roy.....goalie i want in net for game 1 and 7 show me huet in 2009!!!

norskipaul · Senior Member

You've got to imagine the old guys competing on equal terms. Imagine the Canadiens teams of the 50s 60s and 70s playing now with what we know about conditioning, proper diet, etc, etc. Or vica versa, the journey men players of today trying to make it in the six team NHL with the lack of the same knowledge. Who do you think would be "fried chicken"?

rwp2le · Guru

barry33 wrote:

And-O misses the point..again..I did not say who had the best career. Or who was best over a period of time. I said who was the best short term..like one season. And there was a time that Hasek was simply unbeatable..period.

Your 100% right Barry, I guess I skimmed over it to fast. And as for Nils comment, I should have said Roy is the best I have ever seen.

Nil d · Guru

rwp2le wrote:

barry33 wrote:

And-O misses the point..again..I did not say who had the best career. Or who was best over a period of time. I said who was the best short term..like one season. And there was a time that Hasek was simply unbeatable..period.

Your 100% right Barry, I guess I skimmed over it to fast. And as for Nils comment, I should have said Roy is the best I have ever seen.

Actually, that is exactly what you did say, so I'm OK with that. Ken Dryden, Glenn Hall and Terry Sawchuk are probably the best I've ever seen (I remember Jacques Plante, but not at his peak), but were they better than Bill Durnan? Who knows?

barry33 · Guru

Nil d wrote:

rwp2le wrote:

barry33 wrote:

And-O misses the point..again..I did not say who had the best career. Or who was best over a period of time. I said who was the best short term..like one season. And there was a time that Hasek was simply unbeatable..period.

Your 100% right Barry, I guess I skimmed over it to fast. And as for Nils comment, I should have said Roy is the best I have ever seen.

Actually, that is exactly what you did say, so I'm OK with that. Ken Dryden, Glenn Hall and Terry Sawchuk are probably the best I've ever seen (I remember Jacques Plante, but not at his peak), but were they better than Bill Durnan? Who knows?

Nilsey- I see you did not have Barry33 on that list..but then again you never saw me play in my prime