And here's Number 500!

Nil d · Guru

And here's Number 500!

brooklynhabfan · Guru

WELL DONE NIL!

Nil d · Guru

brooklynhabfan wrote:

WELL DONE NIL!

Thanks, Brook. Your big 300th is coming up as well! I may have more posts than you do, but you get my vote for the most entertaining ones!

barry33 · Guru

Nil'd as a habs fan I am open to trying anything now, including a new coach. but I strongly feel that it will be a bandaid solution. This team has problems much deeper than coaching I am afraid. There are problems in that dressing room that need addressed. I do not get the impresison that this is a very close knit team on or off the ice. I feel that the Mike Ribiero cancer from 2 years ago is still there and the only friend he has on that team is Dagenais. You can just tell when the camera shows them on the bench or after a goal is scored. The so called "leaders" on this team need to start leading. I can tell you from experience that players respond much better to their peers and teamates calling them out then they do a coach. It all starts in the dressing room folks. The same people who say that CJ needs to be more ra-ra need to also look at our Captains. I love Koivu. H eleads by example every night out there. But is he the type to stand up in the dressingroom and get these guys going? (please do not jump down my throat Koivu lovers..I love this guy. I am just asking the question).

Gainey did not make the team as strong as he could have in the off season and Julien will pay the price. BONK=BUST . And if And-O tells me one more time that it is because Julien put him in a defensive role I will surely woof up last nights beer. Bonk is horrible. He could care less and he could not score a goal if it mean granting him a pardon on death row. Gainey gave away a very good goalie that would give us an option to Theo when he struggles and for what? Gainey did nothing to strengthen an already suspect defense (uhmmm Streit and Dandeneault? What were you smoking Bob?). Gainey also did nothing to address our lack of goal scoring aside from re-signing Kovalev. Oh yes, He signed Ivanis and some other so called enforcer to a one way contract. Both are destined for permanent residency in Hamilton.

My point remains this. Make a coaching change if you wish. Maybe it will get this sorry excuse for a team off their butts and make them actually try for a couple weeks. But when the dust settles you are still left with a very mediocre team with horribly slow defence, suspect goaltending and no goal scoring.We have guys like Bonk, Ribiero and Dagenais (who Bob so generously gave multi year deals) that no GM in his right mind will touch. We keep throwing their names around as trade bait but do we really think there is a GM in the NHL who is drunk enough to want these overpaid underachievers?!?? If we as fans see that Dagenais cannot skate, that Ribs is too small and selfish, and that Bonk could care less and can;t score, why would we think that NHL GM;s do not see this and if they do, why would they want them on THIER team?!??

Nil d · Guru

barry33 wrote:

Make a coaching change if you wish. Maybe it will get this sorry excuse for a team off their butts and make them actually try for a couple weeks. But when the dust settles you are still left with a very mediocre team with horribly slow defence, suspect goaltending and no goal scoring.We have guys like Bonk, Ribiero and Dagenais (who Bob so generously gave multi year deals) that no GM in his right mind will touch. We keep throwing their names around as trade bait but do we really think there is a GM in the NHL who is drunk enough to want these overpaid underachievers?!?? If we as fans see that Dagenais cannot skate, that Ribs is too small and selfish, and that Bonk could care less and can;t score, why would we think that NHL GM;s do not see this and if they do, why would they want them on THIER team?!??

I agree with you Barry (and your posts win my "Thought-provoking" award!). I didn't say fire the coach; I merely agreed with Ando that he was not motivating his players (Julien, that is not Ando). Ultimately, they will have to motivate themselves, I guess, with guidance from the coaching staff (read: tear a strip off their a$$es). But lack of depth is a problem, especially at defense. I think the forwards will do OK once the two K's are back. I still say get all the team back for a few games, then reassess the situation.

plouf · Guru

barry33 wrote:

Nil'd as a habs fan I am open to trying anything now, including a new coach. but I strongly feel that it will be a bandaid solution. This team has problems much deeper than coaching I am afraid. There are problems in that dressing room that need addressed. I do not get the impresison that this is a very close knit team on or off the ice. I feel that the Mike Ribiero cancer from 2 years ago is still there and the only friend he has on that team is Dagenais. You can just tell when the camera shows them on the bench or after a goal is scored. The so called "leaders" on this team need to start leading. I can tell you from experience that players respond much better to their peers and teamates calling them out then they do a coach. It all starts in the dressing room folks. The same people who say that CJ needs to be more ra-ra need to also look at our Captains. I love Koivu. H eleads by example every night out there. But is he the type to stand up in the dressingroom and get these guys going? (please do not jump down my throat Koivu lovers..I love this guy. I am just asking the question). Gainey did not make the team as strong as he could have in the off season and Julien will pay the price. BONK=BUST . And if And-O tells me one more time that it is because Julien put him in a defensive role I will surely woof up last nights beer. Bonk is horrible. He could care less and he could not score a goal if it mean granting him a pardon on death row. Gainey gave away a very good goalie that would give us an option to Theo when he struggles and for what? Gainey did nothing to strengthen an already suspect defense (uhmmm Streit and Dandeneault? What were you smoking Bob?). Gainey also did nothing to address our lack of goal scoring aside from re-signing Kovalev. Oh yes, He signed Ivanis and some other so called enforcer to a one way contract. Both are destined for permanent residency in Hamilton. My point remains this. Make a coaching change if you wish. Maybe it will get this sorry excuse for a team off their butts and make them actually try for a couple weeks. But when the dust settles you are still left with a very mediocre team with horribly slow defence, suspect goaltending and no goal scoring.We have guys like Bonk, Ribiero and Dagenais (who Bob so generously gave multi year deals) that no GM in his right mind will touch. We keep throwing their names around as trade bait but do we really think there is a GM in the NHL who is drunk enough to want these overpaid underachievers?!?? If we as fans see that Dagenais cannot skate, that Ribs is too small and selfish, and that Bonk could care less and can;t score, why would we think that NHL GM;s do not see this and if they do, why would they want them on THIER team?!??

This post brings up a few things I disagree with most of you on:

(I didn't see last night's game so maybe this is why I still want to defend certain people.)

Dandenault: He has not been a bust, nor is he slow. He's stood out for me as a solid, dependable player in most games I've seen.

Bouillon: I don't think his lack of size hurts him as much as people seem to think. If anything, he just looks less effective because he's small, but plays a better game than both Souray and Komisarek, who occasionally make a big hit but mostly have looked fairly confused out there, especially Souray. Bouillon is an impressive physical presence, actually, and you see him knock people around far more than you see him knocked around. I think the problems yesterday probably had more to do with the mental state of the team as a whole, which I agree...NEEDS TO BE FIXED.

Bonk=Bust: I don't think we can blame Bonk yet, since he's been injured basically the whole season. He's struggling, yes, but we have yet to see him integrated into this team. I think we will be surprised by his form come playoff time.

Dumb penalties: I don't know the stats, but it seems to me the Habs are no worse than any other team for taking dumb penalties. We just notice them more is all. Sometimes it's just the fact that the referees have been inconsistent. (just checked the stats, we are averaging somewhere middle of the pack in penalty minutes)

Defense: People are saying our team hasn't played good defense, they've been leaving Theo hung out to dry, etc... I disagree. I think our defense has been easily the best part of the team this year. Our offense has been stinking up the joint, and our lack of backchecking lately has cost us far more than mistakes by defensemen. The truth is, our DEFENSEMEN have been left with far too many odd-man rushes to deal with and guys moving with speed into our zone. Even in the current horrendous slump we are only giving up 3 goals per game. The problem is scoring, especially our lack of a finishing touch and too many puck hogs generally.

The team is done: No doubt, we are falling fast. But I'd like to point out that we are still 7 games above .500, which given our injury trouble is not as bad as we might have expected. I'm not saying we aren't playing lousy, but I'm not ready to clear the decks either.

The team has to make a trade: I'm not so sure about this either. I think the biggest mistake is that we aren't taking advantage of our depth up front (yes, I did say depth) and rolling 4 lines while so many people are out. Instead of leaning so heavily on a joke line (Ribeiro's) we should be giving guys like Higgins and Perezhogin more ice time. What do we have to trade anyway? It would be nice to get rid of the overpaid underachievers, but those are exactly the guys nobody will want. (As far as depth goes, what team wouldn't look a bit thin without Bonk, Koivu, Kovalev, Komisarek and Markov?)

Fire the coach: No way. I know it's quite possible that Gainey will fire Julien, and I haven't agreed with some of Julien's tactics, but I think you need to ride out slumps. In fact, riding out slumps is the key to becoming a winning team in my opinion. Example: White Sox in playoffs, after brutal slump near end of season. I think 11 games where you go 2 games below .500 is not enough to fire a coach. A third of the way into the season and 5 games below .500 is a different matter perhaps (Boston, Pittsburgh)...

-- Edited by plouf at 20:22, 2005-12-11

Nil d · Guru

Great post, plouf. I agree with you on much of it:

Dandenault: I'd say he's OK; the fourth-best defenseman on the team. No major blunders; fairly steady back there.

Bouillon: I LOVE the Cube! The third-best D on the team, and the best on many nights, Plays much bigger than his size, is a good skater and one of the best in getting the puck out of the zone.

Bonk=Bust: Don't know if I'm with you on this one. To me, he IS a bust; I think Ottawa and LA knew this, and got one over us.

Dumb penalties: It's not the total penalties, it's the types and the timing. Too-many-men ones drive me nuts, as does one during a Hab power-play. And ones when we're already short a man. We seem to have a 2-men-down situation every game.

Defense: A 3.11 GAA is nothing to write home about. I think we're very thin back there. Komi has not played well, and Souray has been in the clouds all year. Streit is an AHLer at best. Even Markov, who can be brilliant, has his off moments (like the first period last night, even though he was the third star of the game.)

The team is done: I agree with you; much too early to panic. Getthe two Ks back and have another look then.

The team has to make a trade: Agree fully; go with what we have once the injuries are healed. But a big free-agent defenseman signing in the off-season would be nice.

Fire the coach: I agree - too early for this talk. I think he's in a slump too, and the team is clearly not motivated, but injuries have not helped. Look at his record so far; still very good.

(Sorry if you readers have to look up to plouf's post, to see what I'm agreeing or disagreeing with. I tried a "Quote" but it was too long.)

plouf · Guru

Maybe you're right about Bonk.

I just gotta believe!

Jedah · Guru

Just wanted to say congrats, Nil! Your posts are always a lot of fun to read. Looking forward to 500 more!

barry33 · Guru

plouf wrote:

Maybe you're right about Bonk. I just gotta believe!

Plouf- just wanted to say that I loved your reply. Thought provoiking and well thought out. Perhaps I am too hard on Dandeneault. My point remains though that there was a ton of talent available in the off season and he was our only signing (aside from re-signing Kovalev and Gainey almost flubbed that up).

Johab · Guru

Congrats Nil d!!! lookin forward to reading 500 more!!!

salted_one · Veteran Member

i used to be very optomistic but thats changed a bit. although i agree with plouf, i still say somthing has to be done very soon. our D is not as bad as it seems and neither is our offence. the worst part of our team is heart or lack there of. and if ribs is knocking his linemates in public who knows what kind of attitude he has in the dressing room. everyone was bashing saks last season when he got into it with ribs, but maybe now we all understand that ribs probably got what he deserved. maybe if we are lucky we can see it happen again, and knock some sence into that cocky mouth peice. only this time let Ryder do the honers im just hes just itchin. remove the cancer (trade, a sit on the bench, or maybe give him the flu) and we might see some beautiful healin.

finaly 25 posts i could make a phone call if i wanted now with my shiny new quarter

heet_150 · Guru

Plouf, amazing post. That would hace taken me hours to put those thoughts together. Well done.

I agree with you on the majority of it, but I want to throw my two cents in on a couple of points.

The team needs to make a trade: With the lackluster, mailing it in performances of late, I think a shakeup of personnel would go quite far in remotivating some of the underachievers. While the prospects of a blockbuster trade aren't there, a move that would send a message to the team that no one is guaranteed a spot just may be what the doctor ordered. I think they are beyond (once everyone is back from ir) healthy scratches being enough.

Bonk=Bust: You say that we can't say that he is a bust yet, because he has been injured for a large part of the season. To me, that is a bust. Essentially, the Habs traded Garon and a draft pick, for Huet (hasn't played a minute for them yet) and Bonk's contract. Garon is turning into a solid NHL goaltender. If Bonk was told that he is to play a defensive role and to not worry about points, I am ok with that (I'm sure the Habs upper management are glad that they have my approval ) but he can't take on that role when he isn't playing. I do not hold Bonk, CJ, or BG responsible for the injuries, but the fact that he isn't playing makes this trade a bust.

In response to Barry's comments about Gainey, and I quote:

"Gainey did not make the team as strong as he could have in the off season and Julien will pay the price. BONK=BUST . And if And-O tells me one more time that it is because Julien put him in a defensive role I will surely woof up last nights beer. Bonk is horrible. He could care less and he could not score a goal if it mean granting him a pardon on death row. Gainey gave away a very good goalie that would give us an option to Theo when he struggles and for what? Gainey did nothing to strengthen an already suspect defense (uhmmm Streit and Dandeneault? What were you smoking Bob?). Gainey also did nothing to address our lack of goal scoring aside from re-signing Kovalev. Oh yes, He signed Ivanis and some other so called enforcer to a one way contract. Both are destined for permanent residency in Hamilton.

My point remains this. Make a coaching change if you wish. Maybe it will get this sorry excuse for a team off their butts and make them actually try for a couple weeks. But when the dust settles you are still left with a very mediocre team with horribly slow defence, suspect goaltending and no goal scoring.We have guys like Bonk, Ribiero and Dagenais (who Bob so generously gave multi year deals) that no GM in his right mind will touch. We keep throwing their names around as trade bait but do we really think there is a GM in the NHL who is drunk enough to want these overpaid underachievers?!?? If we as fans see that Dagenais cannot skate, that Ribs is too small and selfish, and that Bonk could care less and can;t score, why would we think that NHL GM;s do not see this and if they do, why would they want them on THIER team?!??"

Bob Gainey's resume is quite impressive: "After his 16-year playing career, Gainey began coaching the Épinal hockey team, in France, before becoming head coach of the Minnesota North Stars in 1990. One year later, he led the North Stars to the Stanley Cup finals. He was the Stars’ head coach and GM from 1992 to 1996. During that period, he managed the team’s move from Minnesota to Dallas. As the Stars’ General Manager, Gainey led Dallas to one Stanley Cup Championship (1999), five consecutive Division titles (1996 to 2001), and two Presidents’ Trophies as the NHL’s top team during the regular season (1998 and 1999)." I refuse to believe that he became and remains stupid overnight. I've gotten fairly stupid overnight, but soon recovered to my old borderline self.