Begin's Hit

heet_150 · Guru

Begin's Hit

Ando · Guru

CLEAN...CLEAN...CLEAN!!!

Honestly...5 minutes for catching a kid with his head down!!!

I pray this video gets sent to the league office for a good laugh!!!

Fraser made a mistake! And-o won't harp...maybe the play happened sooo fast that he missed it. But it was CLEAN!!!

Markov simply pointed this fact out after OT...and Fraser was embarrassed...so he assessed a misconduct penalty!!!

CLEAN HIT...GREAT HIT!!!

PROOF....NOT ONE SINGLE PENGUIN REACTED NEGATIVELY!!!

Figaro · Guru

It wasnt an elbow but it was a cheap shot, I think. Talbot didn't have the puck, Begin could have avoided the hit and the player was in a compromised position. Granted, the play happened within 1 second or so of the puck be played, so Begin might not have noticed. It was a clean hit, but a nasty hit and maybe a little overboard.

I don't like Fraser and think he should be banned from all Habs games but this call had to be made. Maybe not 5min, 2 or 4. 5 carries an automatic 10 if there is a facial/head injury.

PS Ando, Bonk was great last night with 5 or 6 good chances. Good to have him back and looks like he'll be clicking soon.

barry33 · Guru

Figaro- I hate to say it but in this case I agree with And-O and disagree with you. Begin's hit was not cheap nor dirty. Frasier overreacted. In fact, if you look closely, you will see that Frasier did not even put his arm up after the call and only reacted after seeing the kid not get up. Compafre the hit to the one that Scott Stevens laid on Lindros a few years back that gave Lindros the concussion (or SEVERAL Scott Stevens hits for that matter). No penalty on that play. Lindros had just finished releasing the puck and was admiring his pass when WHAM! THe Stevens freight train arrived at station number 88. Perhaps Begin could have let up a bit, I don't know. Easy to say from here. I hate to see anyone get hurt but when you skate through the neautral zone in the National Hockey League looking at your skate laces you will pay the price. I can guarantee you that had the skate been on the other foot that the Penguins player would have done the same to Begin.

By the way..I have alot of respect for Mario Lemieux. But I for one am sick of the press and announcers calling him by his first name. Mario is angry..Mario is hot tonite..reminds me of Jimmy on Seinfeld. "Jimmy has some new moves". You may recall the same thing doen for Jordan in the NBA. "Michael goes to the foul line". I don't ever recall the play by play guys calling Gretzky "Wayne" when he played. It was Gretzky shoots and scores. As well, what was up with that miraculous recovery? "Mario" lays on the ice motionless like he was shot, arena goes silent, I am awaiting the stretcher, then 30 sedons later he is out scoring a goal.

Figaro · Guru

But Berry, this is the New NHL and if a player is injured I think the refs are supposed to call 5. I thought it was a clean hit, a tad unneeded (I think Begin was trying to spark the team.) But in the old days, that was nothing. Everything is different now. I'm upset that we lost, especially to an AHL team. But I wouldn't isolated this call as the reason. Montreal has yet to play a 60 minute game (maybe 1 or 2) and are lucky to be in first. That is encouraging since we can only go up. I hate being wrong in this case, but I said they were going to take this game for granted and that's why Kovy was normal and that's why we lost. I hope I'm not right when I said that losing this game would start a bad chain. If we lose Saturday, it will be a long road to recovery, maybe.

Anyway, why does it seem to be that every goalie has his A-game vs the Habs?

ray · Senior Member

Too me it looked like a clean hit but if there was another camera it would of helped, the only one I saw was from behind begin, The kid from pittsburgh was reaching for the puck and got caught in awkard position and got nailed. Bad call on Fraser, don't worry the cameras got your nice hair do on the TV. We still could of won this game if we played better and we shouldn't blame it on Fraser even though he is an idiot.

davidb · Guru

I think it was a clean hit. Where was begin suppose to go. The guy dropped his head. I could see in Frazers eyes oh I get the Habs again. I am sorry even Mcguire said it was a clean hit. Frazer has always been a thorn in the side of the Habs

Muller93 · Guru

If you played any competitive hockey in the past...this was a clean hit. If you are stupid enough to float along the ice with the puck and head down...expect to get hit hard. This is not figure skating for god sakes, its hockey!

Figaro · Guru

Muller93 wrote:

If you played any competitive hockey in the past...this was a clean hit. If you are stupid enough to float along the ice with the puck and head down...expect to get hit hard. This is not figure skating for god sakes, its hockey!

The angle I saw, the PIT player didn't have the puck. Begin had room to follow the play. I think it was a fair hit but that it was avoidable. It looked bad and the kid probably got a concussion. I doubt there was intent on Begin's part. He was trying to wake his team up while telling the Penguins that it was Montreal's ice. Overreaction by Frasor, though? Probably. And that is why Begin was so upset. He could understand taking a minor for the hit but was furious where it was 5 and 10. Then Frasor slapped another 10 on for unsportsmanlike. He is an idiot.

Nil d · Guru

Ando wrote:

CLEAN...CLEAN...CLEAN!!! Honestly...5 minutes for catching a kid with his head down!!! I pray this video gets sent to the league office for a good laugh!!! Fraser made a mistake! And-o won't harp...maybe the play happened sooo fast that he missed it. But it was CLEAN!!! Markov simply pointed this fact out after OT...and Fraser was embarrassed...so he assessed a misconduct penalty!!! CLEAN HIT...GREAT HIT!!! PROOF....NOT ONE SINGLE PENGUIN REACTED NEGATIVELY!!!

I agree fully, And-o. The hit was clean and Kerry Fraser realized he made a mistake. When the major penalty call was made, I said to myself (since the only other one in the room was my dog) "there will be an "equalizing" penalty with the five minutes" - and there was. Fraser is the worst referee I've ever seen for doing that.

Muller93 · Guru

Figaro wrote:

Muller93 wrote: If you played any competitive hockey in the past...this was a clean hit. If you are stupid enough to float along the ice with the puck and head down...expect to get hit hard. This is not figure skating for god sakes, its hockey! The angle I saw, the PIT player didn't have the puck. Begin had room to follow the play. I think it was a fair hit but that it was avoidable. It looked bad and the kid probably got a concussion. I doubt there was intent on Begin's part. He was trying to wake his team up while telling the Penguins that it was Montreal's ice. Overreaction by Frasor, though? Probably. And that is why Begin was so upset. He could understand taking a minor for the hit but was furious where it was 5 and 10. Then Frasor slapped another 10 on for unsportsmanlike. He is an idiot.

Avoidable of course. But why? Really, all hits are avoidable. But if the hit is clean, then you need to nail the dumbass under that circumstance. He put his head down fishing for the puck. WAKE UP SON, THIS IS THE NHL!!. I can't stand the no hit garbage now.

And yes Kerry Fraser is a moron. He probably was a wuss as an ex hockey player so that hit " SCARED HIM". BO HOO Fraser, go ref ringette if you don't like hits!!

-- Edited by Muller93 at 17:26, 2005-11-11

Desi · Senior Member

Seems to me that this call has nothing to do with the "New NHL." The rules regarding hitting haven't changed as they pertain to someone carrying (or having just carried) the puck. The problem is that in the "New NHL" refs have gotten into the habit of calling a penalty every time a player hits the ice for any reason. This appeared to me to be a clean hit on a guy who was skating with his head down and who had lowered his head to elbow level! Could Begin have slammed on the brakes or jinked to avoid clobbering him? Maybe, but that ain't his job. He creamed the guy, cleanly, as he should have. No flying elbows, no charging -- no basis for a penalty of any kind really, and certainly no intent to injure. This penalty killed the Habs' momentum and possibly cost them a win. But in the end, they got the tying goal despite Kerry the Fairy. Now if only they could have gotten one past Tee-Bo in the shootout. That's something nobody can blame on Fraser.

Les Canadiens Sont La...

Muller93 · Guru

Right on Desi. That call killed the habs momentum. Really bad call.

In fact, if Begin tried "stopping" from hitting him, he may have hyperextended his own knee resulting in ligament or mensical injury. He kept his elbows out of the hit and cleanly took the guy out. WHEN DID THAT BECOME WRONG? Kerry Fraser is a limp wristed Hab killer. What a terrible call!

davidb · Guru

The fact is, you have no recourse against a ref. They make a call or non call and you must live with it. I say if there is a player you want to level do it in Ot right in the last seconds then you are not penalized because you still have three shooters in a shootout. I wanted Mario leveled last night. I am sorry I am sick and tired of his whinning.

patg · Member

The ref made the call against S. Begin, because it was a head shot. The check was clean, but the ref's today are going to call it.

superhab · Guru

the ref only called it cause Talbot got hurt, in fact at first the ref wasn't going to call it untill he saw Talbot stay down.